http://nihongo.monash.edu/cgi-bin/wwwjdic?1Q�����_1_

@@ -8,0 +9 @@
+<pos>&adv;</pos>

Link to variant pronunciation/term

@@ -10,0 +10,2 @@
+<xref type="see" seq="1004420">こそこそ</xref>
+<xref type="see" seq="1004420">こそこそ</xref>

I think somebody needs to point this out:

あと一台パソコンを購入する君の案はまったく問題にならない。
Your plan to buy another PC is out of the question. [old version]
Your plan to purchase a PC later on will not be a problem at all. [new version]

問題にならない 【もんだいにならない】 (exp,adj-i) unthinkable; count for nothing; not matter; out of the question

Saw your change - much improved. I've actually switched the preferred example to another sentence.

I submitted a change to the English translation of the example sentence because it looks horribly wrong to me.

I've changed all the #2 senses to #1. I can't see any for sense 2 now.

Sentences still need updating.

gg5, daij

Added glosses and [arch] sense.
All the sentences appear to be sense 1 but most of them are tagged sense 2.

@@ -17 +17,3 @@
-<gloss>thought</gloss>
+<gloss>proposal</gloss>
+<gloss>suggestion</gloss>
+<gloss>(government) bill</gloss>
@@ -21,5 +23 @@
-<pos>&n-suf;</pos>
-<xref type="see" seq="1261160">原案</xref>
-<xref type="see" seq="1261160">原案</xref>
-<gloss>draft plan</gloss>
-<gloss>motion</gloss>
+<gloss>draft</gloss>
@@ -30 +27,0 @@
-<pos>&n-suf;</pos>
@@ -32,0 +30,6 @@
+<sense>
+<pos>&n;</pos>
+<misc>&arch;</misc>
+<gloss>desk</gloss>
+<gloss>stand</gloss>
+</sense>

Thanks Robin, I discussed this entry with a native speaker at some length (after my edit) and it turns out I had misinterpreted things a little. 
(I'm continuously impressed with how good you're at picking up things like these - kudos.)

I made my edit after hearing the word on a news show in which Toru Hashimoto was appearing as a commentator. The MC asked him if he really had no intention of 
going back into politics: "ずっと隠居するの？" (or something like that) Now, Hashimoto is only 51 and is still appearing quite frequently on TV as a 
commentator. He hasn't really "retired from active life", but he has handed over the reigns to his party to other people. 

This usage might not be all that representative though. My native informant suggested the focus is really on "leading a quiet life" after retiring without 
really doing anything. daijs has this too: "...静かに暮らすこと。" koj: "...世間から身を引いて気ままに暮らすこと。" daijr: "...のんびりと暮らすこと".　She did not 
think of it as a positive word because of the implication of "hiding", so "... to live out one's golden years" isn't the right nuance here. Since Hashimoto is 
apparently not at all involved in his former party, only commenting on them on TV, I guess this fits that definition somewhat (if you stretch it a little).

I think there's a lot of overlap between senses 1 and 4 and my native informer did not seem to think sense 4 was archaic (we didn't have time to discuss it in 
detail though). I can find some examples of things like 隠居して山に住む but it's hard to say these are definitely sense 4 rather than 1. I think that if we 
add a "secluding oneself" thing to sense 1 we don't need to have a separate "secluding oneself to live in the nature" sense. I think it's in line with the 
koj's "世間から身を引いて" and daij's "静かに/のにびりと" too.

@@ -19,2 +19,2 @@
-<gloss>retirement (from active life)</gloss>
-<gloss>ceasing to handle business or family affairs</gloss>
+<gloss>retiring (from work) to lead a quiet life</gloss>
+<gloss>secluding oneself (after retirement)</gloss>
@@ -33,8 +32,0 @@
-</sense>
-<sense>
-<pos>&n;</pos>
-<pos>&vs;</pos>
-<misc>&arch;</misc>
-<gloss>secluding oneself from society</gloss>
-<gloss>recluse</gloss>
-<gloss>hermit</gloss>

gg5, prog, daijr/s
meikyo: ◇単に、仕事から離れた老人の意でも使う。「横丁のご━さん」
ご隠居	        124566	  
ご隠居さん	21284	
近所のご隠居	493
近所のご隠居さん	286	  
近所の隠居	122

I don't think the part about a successor is necessarily true. The kokugos don't mention it. Also, I think "high position" could be misleading. You can 隠居する from a small family business.
I think it's worth having a separate "retired person" sense to show that it's usually used with ご.
The "secluding oneself" sense appears to be arch/obs. It's not mentioned in the JEs or meikyo/shinmeikai, and daijr's example is archaic.
Added sense.

@@ -19,2 +19,6 @@
-<gloss>retirement (from a high position that will be filled by a successor)</gloss>
-<gloss>giving up (one's position)</gloss>
+<gloss>retirement (from active life)</gloss>
+<gloss>ceasing to handle business or family affairs</gloss>
+</sense>
+<sense>
+<pos>&n;</pos>
+<s_inf>usu. ご隠居(さん)</s_inf>
@@ -25,0 +30,8 @@
+<pos>&vs;</pos>
+<misc>&hist;</misc>
+<gloss>surrendering headship of the family (pre-WWII)</gloss>
+</sense>
+<sense>
+<pos>&n;</pos>
+<pos>&vs;</pos>
+<misc>&arch;</misc>

3rd time's the charm...

@@ -26 +26 @@
-<gloss>exluding oneself from society</gloss>
+<gloss>secluding oneself from society</gloss>

unfortunate typo

@@ -26 +26 @@
-<gloss>sexluding oneself from society</gloss>
+<gloss>exluding oneself from society</gloss>

daiks brit mypedia etc.

@@ -19 +19,4 @@
-<gloss>retirement</gloss>
+<gloss>retirement (from a high position that will be filled by a successor)</gloss>
+<gloss>giving up (one's position)</gloss>
+<gloss>retired person</gloss>
+<gloss>retiree</gloss>
@@ -23,2 +26,3 @@
-<pos>&vs;</pos>
-<gloss>retired person</gloss>
+<gloss>sexluding oneself from society</gloss>
+<gloss>recluse</gloss>
+<gloss>hermit</gloss>

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shogi

Shogi pieces themselves seem to have this old variant engraved

@@ -7,0 +8,4 @@
+</k_ele>
+<k_ele>
+<keb>王將</keb>
+<ke_inf>&oK;</ke_inf>

gg5 wiki

@@ -18 +17,0 @@
-<gloss>king general</gloss>

wiki gg5

The king of the senior player is 王将
and the king of the junior player is 玉将

@@ -17 +17,2 @@
-<gloss>king</gloss>
+<gloss>king (of the senior player)</gloss>
+<gloss>king general</gloss>

koj, daij, gg5, etc.

afaict, only refers to shogi

@@ -15,0 +16 @@
+<field>&shogi;</field>
@@ -18,5 +18,0 @@
-<sense>
-<pos>&n;</pos>
-<field>&shogi;</field>
-<gloss>king (for senior player)</gloss>
-</sense>

@@ -20 +20,2 @@
-<gloss>king (for senior player) (shogi)</gloss>
+<field>&shogi;</field>
+<gloss>king (for senior player)</gloss>

Bulk update n-adv to n,adv
-*- via bulkupd.py -*-

@@ -58 +58,2 @@
-<pos>&n-adv;</pos>
+<pos>&n;</pos>
+<pos>&adv;</pos>

Bulk update n-adv to n,adv
-*- via bulkupd.py -*-

@@ -45 +45,2 @@
-<pos>&n-adv;</pos>
+<pos>&n;</pos>
+<pos>&adv;</pos>

Bulk update n-adv to n,adv
-*- via bulkupd.py -*-

@@ -36 +36 @@
-<pos>&n-adv;</pos>
+<pos>&adv;</pos>

GG5: 今夜限りの命だ. This is my last night alive.   夫婦の縁も今日限りだ. Our relationship as husband and wife ends today.

GG5 has that pattern in its examples of sense 3. OTOH 中辞典 has some in its suffix entry, which looks like our sense 7.
Maybe all that's needed is an "n-suf".

@@ -29,0 +30 @@
+<pos>&n-suf;</pos>

https://hinative.com/ja/questions/8624494
https://nihon5-bunka.net/japanese-grammar-advanced-kagirini/

Hi, I just wanted to leave a comment here. "今日限りで" according to the links supplied means "today is the last day something continues" but if you go by the definitions here, you might mistake it for "today only" because that is the only sense marked as a suffix.

Is perhaps the 3rd sense "the end; the last" missing a suffix marking?

Thanks for all this. I've tried to sort out the linking of examples, although it's rather a mess.
I'll see if I can get that xref working once this is approved.

@@ -51,2 +51,2 @@
-<gloss>not included in ...</gloss>
-<gloss>not part of ...</gloss>
+<gloss>(not) included in ...</gloss>
+<gloss>(not) part of ...</gloss>

koj, daijr, daijs, shinmeikai, meikyo, gg5, prog

i wanted to add a 〜の限りではない sense, as in kojien and meikyo

the pos are still slightly questionable in some cases, but better than before i think.  not every sense is n-adv

there is an additional sense that could be added to cover things like 力の限り = "all of one's strength", but i think this is covered by "to the limits of ...; all of ...", which i merged into sense 4.

@@ -17 +16,0 @@
-<pos>&n-adv;</pos>
@@ -24 +22,0 @@
-<pos>&n-adv;</pos>
@@ -31,15 +28,0 @@
-<pos>&n-adv;</pos>
-<pos>&n;</pos>
-<gloss>as far as possible</gloss>
-<gloss>as much as possible</gloss>
-<gloss>to the best of one's ability</gloss>
-<gloss>very much</gloss>
-</sense>
-<sense>
-<pos>&n-adv;</pos>
-<pos>&n;</pos>
-<s_inf>after neg. verb</s_inf>
-<gloss>unless</gloss>
-</sense>
-<sense>
-<pos>&n-adv;</pos>
@@ -51,3 +34,37 @@
-<pos>&suf;</pos>
-<gloss>as long as</gloss>
-<gloss>only</gloss>
+<pos>&n;</pos>
+<pos>&n-adv;</pos>
+<s_inf>after an adjective, verb, or noun</s_inf>
+<gloss>as long as ...</gloss>
+<gloss>as far as ...</gloss>
+<gloss>as much as ...</gloss>
+<gloss>to the limits of ...</gloss>
+<gloss>all of ...</gloss>
+</sense>
+<sense>
+<pos>&n-adv;</pos>
+<s_inf>after neg. verb</s_inf>
+<gloss>unless ...</gloss>
+</sense>
+<sense>
+<pos>&n;</pos>
+<s_inf>usu. as 〜の限りではない</s_inf>
+<gloss>not included in ...</gloss>
+<gloss>not part of ...</gloss>
+</sense>
+<sense>
+<pos>&n-suf;</pos>
+<pos>&n-adv;</pos>
+<gloss>... only (e.g. "one time only", "today only")</gloss>
+</sense>
+<sense>
+<pos>&n;</pos>
+<misc>&arch;</misc>
+<gloss>end of one's life</gloss>
+<gloss>final moments</gloss>
+<gloss>death</gloss>
+</sense>
+<sense>
+<pos>&n;</pos>
+<misc>&arch;</misc>
+<gloss>funeral</gloss>
+<gloss>burial</gloss>

@@ -41 +41,2 @@
-<gloss>unless (after neg. verb)</gloss>
+<s_inf>after neg. verb</s_inf>
+<gloss>unless</gloss>

"うれしい限りです" means "extremely happy"/"couldn't be happier"
http://detail.chiebukuro.yahoo.co.jp/qa/question_detail/q14132
15609
"うれしい限り" 171k (b)

@@ -36,0 +36,1 @@
+<gloss>very much</gloss>

新和英中辞典

PLEASE give references for such suggestions.

@@ -48,0 +48,5 @@
+<sense>
+<pos>&suf;</pos>
+<gloss>as long as</gloss>
+<gloss>only</gloss>
+</sense>

Hi, I understand that ～限り can also mean "as long as ～" in some contexts. If correct I think it would be helpful to add that as another sense.

not idiomatic yojijukugo.
I don't think "the syllabary order" is a great gloss.

@@ -12,2 +12,2 @@
-<misc>&yoji;</misc>
-<gloss>the syllabary order</gloss>
+<xref type="see" seq="1268300">五十音</xref>
+<gloss>gojūon syllabary order</gloss>

Kanji Haitani list

Adding yoji tagAdding yoji tag
-*- via bulkupd.py -*-

@@ -11,0 +12 @@
+<misc>&yoji;</misc>

輪車 is a bit similar, except that here 輪 (rin) is the counter for wheels.
There is a limit to how far dictionary entries can go in assisting learners to sort out Japanese morphology. Putting entries for fragments which are never actually free-standing lexemes is a step too far.

A search for 音順 reveals:
Partial match - original key: 音順 [G][S][A] Propose a new entry for 音順, or search all dictionaries.
五十音順 【ごじゅうおんじゅん】 (n) the syllabary order

It strikes me that these results are 100% analogous to your results for the 輪車 search.

音順 should not be an entry by itself, but when you search for it, 五十音順 nevertheless shows up as a hit.  What is the complaint?

See below.

I understand your point, however in a similar example you have dealt with it in the manner of the original discussion.

If you search for "車" the following entry comes up:-

車 【しゃ】 (n-suf) car; vehicle

One can see that it is a suffix as well as a noun and one can search down the list of suffixes.

If you search for "輪車" there is not an entry.


However, that search will take the searcher directly to the following:-

Search Key: 輪車 Current Dictionary: Jpn-Eng General (EDICT) 
Partial match - original key: 輪車 [G][S][A] Propose a new entry for 輪車, or search all dictionaries. 

一輪車 【いちりんしゃ】 (n) unicycle; monocycle; wheelbarrow
三輪車 【さんりんしゃ】 (n) three wheeled vehicle (tricycle, motorcycle, etc.); three wheeler
二輪車 【にりんしゃ】 (n) two wheeled vehicle (bicycle, motorcycle, etc.); (P)
四輪車 【よんりんしゃ】 (n) automobile; car; (P)

This seems to be a similar situation to point about searching for "音順" in order for the novice to find "五十音順".

You don't need to look down the list. The very first entry is 順 itself, which says it's a suffix, then the next 10 or so all have it as the final kanji in compounds. That should tell you it's likely to be 五十音 + 順.

See below.

I agree with your comments. The "順" is normally just the suffix. When I check to find it as a suffix, it takes 2 clicks on the 100+ entries for "五十音順" to come up. This is OK if the searcher knows what to expect and clicks away until the entry is found. The result could of course only turn up as the last entry of the 100+. I suppose that, at the end of the day, one has to decide whether or not to deviate from the standard rules to tackle the exception. Dealing with oddities was always relatively easy when one printed off the book [save of course for the endless burden of having to decide upon the problem of how far to go in dealing with oddities], but with electronic search format I guess that wider problems come into play.

I can't really do that because it's 五十音 + 順, not 五十 + 音順. As far as I can tell, 音順 is simply not a recognized term in Japanese. (My IME will make it, but then it has all sorts of fragments.) I think you are going to have to rely on looking up 順 and finding that it's a suffix.
I'll leave this open for a bit.

See below.

In like mode to my "おほしさま" submission, I am wondering if you would consider making an adjustment to the above so that I can find this entry by searching for "音じゅん" or "音順".

When, as a novice, one sees a number followed by some kanji, one generally knows that a search which starts off with the number will not get a result, e.g., in a search for "三十ページ", one can search for "三十" and then "ページ" and get a meaningful result for the combination. However, one does not get a result when one searches for the complete "三十ページ". The reason is obvious and requires no explanation.

When one is faced with an entry like the main entry above, the logic of the above paragraph falls away, but the novice does not know that in advance and tends to search for "音じゅん" or "音順" with the result that the the main entry is not found. Moreover, a search for the individual parts could not give the meaning of the complete meaning attributed to "五十音順".

I trust that the above is helpful.

koj, daij

@@ -13,0 +13,3 @@
+</r_ele>
+<r_ele>
+<reb>せいぞく</reb>

http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/世俗主�
%A9
http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/世俗
eij

@@ -24,0 +24,5 @@
+<sense>
+<pos>&n;</pos>
+<pos>&adj-no;</pos>
+<gloss>secularity</gloss>
+</sense>

@@ -11,0 +12 @@
+<field>&shogi;</field>
@@ -13 +13,0 @@
-<gloss>king (shogi)</gloss>

Entry created

daij
not only used talking about people.

@@ -5 +5 @@
-<keb>何方も何方</keb>
+<keb>何方もどっち</keb>
@@ -12,2 +12,4 @@
-<misc>&id;</misc>
-<gloss>They are both to blame</gloss>
+<misc>&uk;</misc>
+<gloss>neither is great</gloss>
+<gloss>both are bad</gloss>
+<gloss>both are to blame</gloss>

Entry created

旧車會	4348
旧車会	11289

@@ -3,0 +4,3 @@
+<k_ele>
+<keb>旧車会</keb>
+</k_ele>

https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/旧車會

Just a biker group that resembles 暴走族 in certain ways.

@@ -12,2 +12 @@
-<xref type="see" seq="1519490">暴走族</xref>
-<gloss>bōsōzoku using classic motorbikes</gloss>
+<gloss>biker group in which members ride customized classic motorcycles</gloss>

Are they really bōsōzoku? Or just a type of biker group?

@@ -13 +13 @@
-<gloss>biker club using classic motorbikes</gloss>
+<gloss>bōsōzoku using classic motorbikes</gloss>

Daijr

Simpler

@@ -13 +13 @@
-<gloss>delinquent biker club composed of bikers who cherish classic motorcycles</gloss>
+<gloss>biker club using classic motorbikes</gloss>

wiki google images (e.g. https://i1.wp.com/kinzoupro.com/wp-content/uploads/1fa2da66a3040f30dd79b01b73a36427-01.jpg)

not the same as  旧車会

not actually worthless, it's a scoring combination. my bad.

@@ -21,0 +22 @@
+<xref type="see" seq="1895940">手役</xref>
@@ -23,2 +24 @@
-<gloss>worthless hand at the start of a game</gloss>
-<gloss>being dealt a hand containing only 1-point cards</gloss>
+<gloss>dealt hand containing only 1-point cards (scoring combination)</gloss>

Looking at various hanafuda rulebooks (post- and pre-war), 空素 is actually the most common kanji for this word.

空巣 is mentioned here https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/八八 (attributed to 淡路まもる編『花札の遊び方』 昭和56)
and here:
https://dandeliongameblog.com/hanafuda88asobikatayakunoshuruitotennsuukeisan/
https://9218.teacup.com/ishimi/bbs?page=8
http://pigphone.blog96.fc2.com/blog-entry-71.html
https://ameblo.jp/himekatakamuna/entry-12277332311.html

空素	557
皆素	450

空巣	8437 (also あきす)

the nikk example (from 1887‐88) is in katakana.

@@ -4,0 +5,3 @@
+<keb>空素</keb>
+</k_ele>
+<k_ele>
@@ -5,0 +9,3 @@
+</k_ele>
+<k_ele>
+<keb>空巣</keb>
@@ -8,0 +15,4 @@
+</r_ele>
+<r_ele>
+<reb>カラス</reb>
+<re_nokanji/>

@@ -12,2 +12,2 @@
-<xref type="see" seq="1194690">花札</xref>
-<gloss>worthless hand at the start of a game of hanafuda</gloss>
+<field>&hanaf;</field>
+<gloss>worthless hand at the start of a game</gloss>

@@ -14 +14 @@
-<gloss>being dealt a hand containing only 1 point cards</gloss>
+<gloss>being dealt a hand containing only 1-point cards</gloss>

皆素	450

daijs

jitsuyo
おかげをもちまして	16525
お陰を持ちまして	2355
お陰をもちまして	6068

daijs

Do adjectival glosses maybe work better here?
I feel this sense is only.correct in 
conditional propositons, ~ば...,~たら... , ~な
ら... etc.
Maybe that should be in a note?

@@ -12,3 +12,3 @@
-<gloss>no need to waste time</gloss>
-<gloss>that's settled then</gloss>
-<gloss>things can move along</gloss>
+<gloss>easy to solve</gloss>
+<gloss>easy to deal with</gloss>
+<gloss>no problem</gloss>

中辞典: 顔が広いから彼に頼めば話が早い. As he has good connections if we ask him, things will move right along.
GG5: なんだ, その店を知ってるんなら, 話が早い． Oh, if you know the place, there's no problem.
彼に直接頼んだほうが話が早い． You'll save time by asking him yourself.
Eijiro: これなら話が早い。 : This simplifies matters
話が早い	28912
なら話が早い	1107

Useful.

@@ -12,2 +12 @@
-<gloss>(usu. with なら) no need to waste time (on this conversation)</gloss>
-<gloss>we see eye to eye already</gloss>
+<gloss>no need to waste time</gloss>
@@ -14,0 +14 @@
+<gloss>things can move along</gloss>

大辞泉
https://hinative.com/ja/questions/5430934
https://eikaiwa.dmm.com/uknow/questions/400/
https://ejje.weblio.jp/content/それなら話は早い！