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1. |
[prt]
▶ if ... then ▶ when |
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2. |
[prt]
《often ...も...ば...も...》 ▶ and |
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3. |
[prt]
《sentence final》 ▶ why don't you...? |
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4. |
[prt]
《often ...ば...ほど》 ▶ the more (one does something) |
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5. |
[prt]
[arch]
▶ because ▶ since |
11. | A* 2024-05-03 07:33:46 Non | |
Refs: | I did not think any references would be needed, It is formally classified as a 接続助詞 just about everywhere: daijs, daijr, smk, meikyo, koj... |
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Comments: | ば's primordial function is to connect two clauses, clause A to clause B, where A is in some manner precedent to B, this should be in line with the citation you have just provided of a conjunction. Additionally, I do not see how these definitions would - or even could - be mutually exclusive: every single conjunction has a grammatical aspect to it, it must always form a syntactically subordinating or coordinating relation in between the two linked items; dismissing [3] as an omission of clause B, and with the potential exclusion of [2], ば falls into the former type. I must also bring to attention that the definition of a conjunction provided is vague and potentially problematic, for example: how does it deal with a coordinating conjunction between two nouns? ”僕と君と...”or anything following the same structure will be constituted of two words that are not particularly large units of meaning, certainly not clauses, and I do not think most would consider each a phrase. Would と cease to be a conjunction? would also または or および? This is not limited to Japanese either, you can just as easily take "Me and you..." and the same problem arises. Lastly, not classifying ば as a conjunction makes the corpus inconsistent: other terms formally classified as 接続助詞 such as と, けれども and its variants have both [conj] and [prt] on their entries; notably, なら and たら both directly derive from ば and are classed as [conj] (though the former's entry is itself a tad inconsistent). Now, as the meaning does not change even in their original forms of ならば and たらば, if ば is not a conjunction, what is it? or rather, if it is not, how are they? |
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10. | A 2024-05-03 02:00:13 Jim Breen <...address hidden...> | |
Refs: | None were provided. |
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Comments: | I regard particles and conjunctions as different things. To quote one reference: "Particles indicate grammatical relationships between words, while conjunctions connect larger units of meaning such as clauses or sentences." |
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Diff: | @@ -10 +9,0 @@ -<pos>&conj;</pos> @@ -16 +14,0 @@ -<pos>&conj;</pos> @@ -22 +19,0 @@ -<pos>&conj;</pos> @@ -28 +24,0 @@ -<pos>&conj;</pos> @@ -34 +29,0 @@ -<pos>&conj;</pos> |
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9. | A* 2024-05-01 06:59:54 Non | |
Comments: | It is a conjunction, marking it as such. |
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Diff: | @@ -9,0 +10 @@ +<pos>&conj;</pos> @@ -14,0 +16 @@ +<pos>&conj;</pos> @@ -19,0 +22 @@ +<pos>&conj;</pos> @@ -24,0 +28 @@ +<pos>&conj;</pos> @@ -29,0 +34 @@ +<pos>&conj;</pos> |
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8. | A 2021-04-09 00:28:02 Jim Breen <...address hidden...> | |
7. | A* 2021-04-05 07:00:52 dine | |
Refs: | previous discussion |
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Diff: | @@ -19,0 +20 @@ +<s_inf>sentence final</s_inf> |
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(show/hide 6 older log entries) |
1. |
[prt]
▶ if ... then ▶ when |
|
2. |
[prt]
《often ...も...ば...も...》 ▶ and |
|
3. |
[prt]
《sentence final》 ▶ why don't you...? |
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4. |
[prt]
《often ...ば...ほど》 ▶ the more (one does something) |
|
5. |
[prt]
[arch]
▶ because ▶ since |
10. | A 2024-05-03 02:00:13 Jim Breen <...address hidden...> | |
Refs: | None were provided. |
|
Comments: | I regard particles and conjunctions as different things. To quote one reference: "Particles indicate grammatical relationships between words, while conjunctions connect larger units of meaning such as clauses or sentences." |
|
Diff: | @@ -10 +9,0 @@ -<pos>&conj;</pos> @@ -16 +14,0 @@ -<pos>&conj;</pos> @@ -22 +19,0 @@ -<pos>&conj;</pos> @@ -28 +24,0 @@ -<pos>&conj;</pos> @@ -34 +29,0 @@ -<pos>&conj;</pos> |
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9. | A* 2024-05-01 06:59:54 Non | |
Comments: | It is a conjunction, marking it as such. |
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Diff: | @@ -9,0 +10 @@ +<pos>&conj;</pos> @@ -14,0 +16 @@ +<pos>&conj;</pos> @@ -19,0 +22 @@ +<pos>&conj;</pos> @@ -24,0 +28 @@ +<pos>&conj;</pos> @@ -29,0 +34 @@ +<pos>&conj;</pos> |
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8. | A 2021-04-09 00:28:02 Jim Breen <...address hidden...> | |
7. | A* 2021-04-05 07:00:52 dine | |
Refs: | previous discussion |
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Diff: | @@ -19,0 +20 @@ +<s_inf>sentence final</s_inf> |
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6. | A 2015-05-24 06:01:10 Rene Malenfant <...address hidden...> | |
(show/hide 5 older log entries) |