jmdict
1783220
Active
(id:
2153333)
<entry id="2153333" stat="A" corpus="jmdict" type="jmdict">
<ent_corp type="jmdict">jmdict</ent_corp>
<ent_seq>1783220</ent_seq>
<k_ele>
<keb>梅園</keb>
<ke_pri>news2</ke_pri>
<ke_pri>nf45</ke_pri>
</k_ele>
<r_ele>
<reb>ばいえん</reb>
<re_pri>news2</re_pri>
<re_pri>nf45</re_pri>
</r_ele>
<r_ele>
<reb>うめぞの</reb>
</r_ele>
<sense>
<pos>&n;</pos>
<xref type="see" seq="1473460">梅・うめ・1</xref>
<gloss>Japanese apricot orchard</gloss>
<gloss>plum orchard</gloss>
<gloss>plum garden</gloss>
<gloss>ume orchard</gloss>
</sense>
<info>
<audit time="2020-12-20 10:40:14" stat="A" unap="true">
<upd_name>Nicolas Maia</upd_name>
<upd_diff>@@ -16 +16,2 @@
-<gloss>plum garden or orchard</gloss>
+<gloss>plum garden</gloss>
+<gloss>plum orchard</gloss></upd_diff>
</audit>
<audit time="2020-12-20 11:35:26" stat="A">
<upd_uid>robin1354</upd_uid>
<upd_name>Robin Scott</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_refs>gg5</upd_refs>
<upd_diff>@@ -16,2 +16,3 @@
-<gloss>plum garden</gloss>
-<gloss>plum orchard</gloss>
+<xref type="see" seq="1473460">梅・うめ・1</xref>
+<gloss>Japanese-apricot orchard</gloss>
+<gloss>ume garden</gloss></upd_diff>
</audit>
<audit time="2020-12-20 23:59:45" stat="A" unap="true">
<upd_name>Marcus Richert</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_detl>Strictly speaking more correct, but ar they
really better glosses? I prefer "plum
orchard/garden", I think this is what it'll
normally be translated as.</upd_detl>
</audit>
<audit time="2020-12-21 02:05:46" stat="A">
<upd_uid>jwb</upd_uid>
<upd_name>Jim Breen</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_detl>I think it should go in as well. I'm not sure I'd call 梅 = "plum" an example of 俗.</upd_detl>
<upd_refs>GG5 just has apricot, ルミナス has ume.
中辞典: an apricot [a plum (俗に)] orchard [garden].</upd_refs>
<upd_diff>@@ -17,0 +18 @@
+<gloss>plum orchard</gloss></upd_diff>
</audit>
<audit time="2020-12-21 03:29:42" stat="A" unap="true">
<upd_uid>Marcus</upd_uid>
<upd_name>Marcus Richert</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_detl>I really don't think we need to be concerned about using the correct nomenclature of the species when it comes to words like 梅園.
(I'd be happy to entirely leave out the Japanese-apricot/ume glosses)</upd_detl>
<upd_refs>koj daijr nikk
(googling 梅園, the first two hits were for two places called "umezono", one in Kyoto, one in Tokyo, so it's not an obscure reading,
even if it might be most commonly used as a proper noun)
Googling either "baien" or "umezono" + garden or orchard in English, all descriptions of places featuring ume trees use the word "plum".
https://www.brooklynmuseum.org/opencollection/objects/121642
"Plum Garden, Kamata (Kamata no Umezono)"
https://collections.mfa.org/objects/237073
"Plum Garden at Kamata (Kamata no umezono)"
https://www.norenkai.net/en/portfolio-item/umezono/
"Umezono opened its doors in 1854 as a tea house in one corner of Baion-in, which means “Plum Garden Pavilion”, on the grounds of
Sensoji Temple in Asakusa. The name “Umezono” is the Japanese reading of the Chinese characters “Baion”, and also means “Plum Garden”."
https://travel.ataminews.gr.jp/en/what-to-see/37/
https://www.gotokyo.org/en/spot/539/index.html
https://www.japan-experience.com/city-kamakura/atami-baien-garden
https://ota-tokyo.com/destination/ikegami-baien-plum-garden/27668
https://unique-ota.city.ota.tokyo.jp/en/charm/nature/ikegami-baien/
https://japan-magazine.jnto.go.jp/en/1701_plum.html
https://www.mlit.go.jp/kankocho/cruise/detail/093/documents/kanko.pdf
https://japan-photo.jnto.go.jp/eng/photo_detail.php?PI=160117</upd_refs>
<upd_diff>@@ -13,0 +14,3 @@
+<r_ele>
+<reb>うめぞの</reb>
+</r_ele>
@@ -16,0 +20,2 @@
+<gloss>plum orchard</gloss>
+<gloss>plum garden</gloss>
@@ -18 +22,0 @@
-<gloss>plum orchard</gloss></upd_diff>
</audit>
<audit time="2020-12-23 01:28:11" stat="A" unap="true">
<upd_uid>robin1354</upd_uid>
<upd_name>Robin Scott</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_detl>I don't object to having "plum orchard" as a gloss but I think we need to make clear that it's specifically an orchard of ume. "Plum orchard" in English would not be translated as "梅園".</upd_detl>
</audit>
<audit time="2020-12-23 03:29:06" stat="A" unap="true">
<upd_name>Marcus Richert</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_detl>That's true, but the 14/15 first results in Google for "plum orchard" (in English) are actually about Japanese plum orchards (at least when
I google it, might be personalized of course). Most of the google images for "plum orchard" too seem to show pictures of Japanese plum.
I think the xref to 梅 is enough.</upd_detl>
</audit>
<audit time="2020-12-27 01:02:47" stat="A" unap="true">
<upd_uid>robin1354</upd_uid>
<upd_name>Robin Scott</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_detl>I get a lot of regular plum results on Google images searching from the UK. I think we need to include the correct species in at least one of the glosses, preferably the first one.</upd_detl>
<upd_diff>@@ -19,0 +20 @@
+<gloss>ume orchard</gloss>
@@ -22,2 +22,0 @@
-<gloss>Japanese-apricot orchard</gloss>
-<gloss>ume garden</gloss></upd_diff>
</audit>
<audit time="2020-12-27 03:26:41" stat="A">
<upd_uid>jwb</upd_uid>
<upd_name>Jim Breen</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_detl>I'm comfortable with this version.</upd_detl>
</audit>
<audit time="2021-10-17 16:04:12" stat="A" unap="true">
<upd_name>Marcus Richert</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_detl>Since this is the first gloss in the 梅
entry... i feel "ume orchard" can confuse
people who aren't familiar with the word "ume"
(which I assume is most of everyone)</upd_detl>
<upd_diff>@@ -20 +20 @@
-<gloss>ume orchard</gloss>
+<gloss>Japanese apricot orchard</gloss></upd_diff>
</audit>
<audit time="2021-10-23 00:21:17" stat="A">
<upd_uid>jwb</upd_uid>
<upd_name>Jim Breen</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_detl>I'd keep it in there.</upd_detl>
<upd_diff>@@ -20,0 +21 @@
+<gloss>ume orchard</gloss></upd_diff>
</audit>
<audit time="2021-10-23 02:28:28" stat="A" unap="true">
<upd_name>Marcus Richert</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_detl>can we move it to the bottom? I think one "correct translation" in the lead is enough, the much more
common "plum" ones should follow</upd_detl>
<upd_diff>@@ -21 +20,0 @@
-<gloss>ume orchard</gloss>
@@ -23,0 +23 @@
+<gloss>ume orchard</gloss></upd_diff>
</audit>
<audit time="2021-10-23 05:35:02" stat="A">
<upd_uid>jwb</upd_uid>
<upd_name>Jim Breen</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_detl>OK</upd_detl>
</audit>
</info>
</entry>