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jmdict 2859257 Active (id: 2283835)
有れ [rK] ；在れ [rK]
【あれ】

[exp] [uk,dated]
《imperative form of ある》
▶ let there be ...
▶ may it be ...

[aux] [uk,dated]
《after a verb stem or verbal noun prefixed with the honorific 御》
▶ please do ...

Cross references:
	⇒ see: 2859247 お試しあれ 1. give it a try!

History:

10.	A 2023-11-19 02:40:21 Robin Scott <...address hidden...>
	Comments:	This is probably the best option.
9.	A* 2023-11-18 03:37:40 Stephen Kraus <...address hidden...>
	Comments:	My reasoning for the second sense was that ある is acting as an auxiliary verb (attaching to a noun or stem), but since it's an inflected form and not the dictionary form we would just use [aux] instead of [aux-v]. I wasn't sure about the first sense. I was reluctant about [exp] because we're not defining it as an independent clause (although I guess in principle it could function as one). But now I see we're using [exp] for other imperative verb inflections (でありなさい, ください, なさいませ) that aren't independent clauses either.
	Diff:	@@ -16 +16 @@ -<pos>&aux;</pos> +<pos>&exp;</pos>
8.	A* 2023-11-18 01:47:48 Robin Scott <...address hidden...>
	Comments:	I'm not sure about aux. I wasn't aware we were still using it. I don't even remember what it's for.
7.	A 2023-11-17 06:29:15 Jim Breen <...address hidden...>
	Comments:	Let's go with that. Seems to cover the important points.
6.	A* 2023-11-17 02:18:53 Stephen Kraus <...address hidden...>
	Refs:	╭─ーーーーーー─┬────────╮ │ 光あれ　　　 │ 17,009 │ │ と共にあれ　 │ 2,482 │ │ とともにあれ │ 2,257 │ ╰─ーーーーーー─┴────────╯
	Comments:	Sounds like a good idea to me. Maybe this works. I think "be" and "have" can be dropped from the second sense. Like I said, the refs describe it as "なさる" and "て下さい"
	Diff:	@@ -16,0 +17,8 @@ +<misc>&uk;</misc> +<misc>&dated;</misc> +<s_inf>imperative form of ある</s_inf> +<gloss>let there be ...</gloss> +<gloss>may it be ...</gloss> +</sense> +<sense> +<pos>&aux;</pos> @@ -22,2 +29,0 @@ -<gloss>please be ...</gloss> -<gloss>please have ...</gloss>
(show/hide 5 older log entries)
5.	A* 2023-11-17 01:40:35 Robin Scott <...address hidden...>
	Comments:	Should we also have a sense for standard imperative usage (like 光あれ from Genesis)?
4.	A* 2023-11-16 01:08:30 Stephen Kraus <...address hidden...>
	Refs:	Meikyo says 古語的な言い方 and daijirin says it's not really 現代語. I think a [dated] tag is better than a sense note. Whether or not a usage is jocular can probably be interpreted from context. I think the most useful thing to mention is that this is always お／ご／御 + verb + あれ. That's how most of the refs begin their definitions. The connection to 有る・在る is already made clear by the kanji forms in this entry. I think a cross-reference to an example would be more useful.
	Diff:	@@ -17,2 +17 @@ -<xref type="see" seq="1296400">ある・1</xref> -<xref type="see" seq="1296400">ある・2</xref> +<xref type="see" seq="2859247">お試しあれ</xref> @@ -20 +19,2 @@ -<s_inf>imperative form of ある; archaic or slightly jocular</s_inf> +<misc>&dated;</misc> +<s_inf>after a verb stem or verbal noun prefixed with the honorific 御</s_inf>
3.	A 2023-11-16 00:52:39 Jim Breen <...address hidden...>
	Comments:	Looks good.
	Diff:	@@ -16 +16 @@ -<pos>&exp;</pos> +<pos>&aux;</pos>
2.	A* 2023-11-15 07:45:16 Stephen Kraus <...address hidden...>
	Refs:	For copyright reasons I'm reluctant to paste large excerpts from the kokugos. These are the relevant sections of their entries for 有る・在る. Sankoku 7e-8e: 二⑤, "〔〈お／ご〉…" Meikyo 2e: 二⑤, "《「お［ご］…" Meikyo 3e: J⑤, "《「お［ご］…" Iwakoku 6e-8e: 一②キ, "《動作を表す…" Daijirin 3e-4e: 二➎, "動作性の漢語…" Iwakoku defines this sense as "なさる。" Meikyo describes it as an old form of speech corresponding to the modern 〜て下さい. All the refs say this is an auxiliary form of ある that attaches to a suru noun or verb stem prefixed with お/ご/御. It doesn't necessarily have to be あれ; Iwakoku gives "御一考ありたい" as another example with the same meaning. I guess technically this might belong in the main 有る entry. Not sure if [exp] would be the right PoS. Maybe [aux]?
	Comments:	I'll try to revisit this later, but feel free to pick up from here.
	Diff:	@@ -20,0 +21 @@ +<gloss>please do ...</gloss>
1.	A* 2023-11-15 03:41:01 Marcus Richert
	Comments:	See the discussion in the お試しあれ entry. Feel free to improve.

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