JMdictDB - Japanese Dictionary Database

Entries

Search | Advanced Search | New Entry | Submissions | Help | Doc
Login for registered editors
Username:
Password:
jmdict 2029040 Active (id: 2343812)
<entry id="2343812" stat="A" corpus="jmdict" type="jmdict">
<ent_corp type="jmdict">jmdict</ent_corp>
<ent_seq>2029040</ent_seq>
<r_ele>
<reb>ば</reb>
<re_pri>spec1</re_pri>
</r_ele>
<sense>
<pos>&prt;</pos>
<pos>&conj;</pos>
<gloss>if ... then</gloss>
<gloss>when</gloss>
</sense>
<sense>
<pos>&prt;</pos>
<pos>&conj;</pos>
<s_inf>often ...も...ば...も...</s_inf>
<gloss>and</gloss>
</sense>
<sense>
<pos>&prt;</pos>
<s_inf>sentence final</s_inf>
<gloss>why don't you ...?</gloss>
</sense>
<sense>
<pos>&prt;</pos>
<pos>&conj;</pos>
<s_inf>often ...ば...ほど</s_inf>
<gloss>the more (one does something)</gloss>
</sense>
<sense>
<pos>&prt;</pos>
<pos>&conj;</pos>
<misc>&arch;</misc>
<gloss>because</gloss>
<gloss>since</gloss>
</sense>
<info>
<audit time="2005-03-05 00:00:00" stat="A">
<upd_detl>Entry created</upd_detl>
</audit>
<audit time="2014-11-10 23:55:49" stat="A" unap="true">
<upd_name>Curtis Naito</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_refs>For #2, see GG5. I suspect that this is probably a shortened form of "ばどうですか".

For #3, see The Handbook of Japanese Grammar by Harold G. Henderson (page 45). Henderson gives an example sentence of this on page 51, "Akatsuki tori ame fureba onaji tokoro ni tomareri=Since it has been raining from early morning, I have stayed in the same place."</upd_refs>
<upd_diff>@@ -12,0 +13,9 @@
+&lt;sense&gt;
+&lt;pos&gt;&amp;prt;&lt;/pos&gt;
+&lt;gloss&gt;why don't you...?&lt;/gloss&gt;
+&lt;/sense&gt;
+&lt;sense&gt;
+&lt;pos&gt;&amp;prt;&lt;/pos&gt;
+&lt;gloss&gt;because&lt;/gloss&gt;
+&lt;gloss&gt;since&lt;/gloss&gt;
+&lt;/sense&gt;</upd_diff>
</audit>
<audit time="2014-11-11 05:53:48" stat="A" unap="true">
<upd_uid>rene</upd_uid>
<upd_name>Rene Malenfant</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_detl>i suspect sense 4 is archaic.</upd_detl>
<upd_refs>koj, daij, naoko chino</upd_refs>
<upd_diff>@@ -10 +9,0 @@
-&lt;gloss&gt;indicates supposition&lt;/gloss&gt;
@@ -11,0 +11,5 @@
+&lt;gloss&gt;when&lt;/gloss&gt;
+&lt;/sense&gt;
+&lt;sense&gt;
+&lt;pos&gt;&amp;prt;&lt;/pos&gt;
+&lt;gloss&gt;and&lt;/gloss&gt;
@@ -18,0 +23 @@
+&lt;misc&gt;&amp;arch;&lt;/misc&gt;</upd_diff>
</audit>
<audit time="2014-11-12 04:53:36" stat="A">
<upd_uid>jwb</upd_uid>
<upd_name>Jim Breen</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
</audit>
<audit time="2015-05-24 04:21:20" stat="A" unap="true">
<upd_name>Jim Breen</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_refs>GG5, discussions with a teacher.</upd_refs>
<upd_diff>@@ -14,0 +15 @@
+&lt;s_inf&gt;often ...も...ば...も...&lt;/s_inf&gt;
@@ -22,0 +24,5 @@
+&lt;s_inf&gt;often ...ば...ほど&lt;/s_inf&gt;
+&lt;gloss&gt;the more (one does something)&lt;/gloss&gt;
+&lt;/sense&gt;
+&lt;sense&gt;
+&lt;pos&gt;&amp;prt;&lt;/pos&gt;</upd_diff>
</audit>
<audit time="2015-05-24 06:01:10" stat="A">
<upd_uid>rene</upd_uid>
<upd_name>Rene Malenfant</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
</audit>
<audit time="2021-04-05 07:00:52" stat="A" unap="true">
<upd_name>dine</upd_name>
<upd_refs>previous discussion</upd_refs>
<upd_diff>@@ -19,0 +20 @@
+&lt;s_inf&gt;sentence final&lt;/s_inf&gt;</upd_diff>
</audit>
<audit time="2021-04-09 00:28:02" stat="A">
<upd_uid>jwb</upd_uid>
<upd_name>Jim Breen</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
</audit>
<audit time="2024-05-01 06:59:54" stat="A" unap="true">
<upd_name>Non</upd_name>
<upd_detl>It is a conjunction, marking it as such.</upd_detl>
<upd_diff>@@ -9,0 +10 @@
+&lt;pos&gt;&amp;conj;&lt;/pos&gt;
@@ -14,0 +16 @@
+&lt;pos&gt;&amp;conj;&lt;/pos&gt;
@@ -19,0 +22 @@
+&lt;pos&gt;&amp;conj;&lt;/pos&gt;
@@ -24,0 +28 @@
+&lt;pos&gt;&amp;conj;&lt;/pos&gt;
@@ -29,0 +34 @@
+&lt;pos&gt;&amp;conj;&lt;/pos&gt;</upd_diff>
</audit>
<audit time="2024-05-03 02:00:13" stat="A">
<upd_uid>jwb</upd_uid>
<upd_name>Jim Breen</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_detl>I regard particles and conjunctions as different things. To quote one reference: "Particles indicate grammatical relationships between words, while conjunctions connect larger units of meaning such as clauses or sentences."</upd_detl>
<upd_refs>None were provided.</upd_refs>
<upd_diff>@@ -10 +9,0 @@
-&lt;pos&gt;&amp;conj;&lt;/pos&gt;
@@ -16 +14,0 @@
-&lt;pos&gt;&amp;conj;&lt;/pos&gt;
@@ -22 +19,0 @@
-&lt;pos&gt;&amp;conj;&lt;/pos&gt;
@@ -28 +24,0 @@
-&lt;pos&gt;&amp;conj;&lt;/pos&gt;
@@ -34 +29,0 @@
-&lt;pos&gt;&amp;conj;&lt;/pos&gt;</upd_diff>
</audit>
<audit time="2024-05-03 07:33:46" stat="A" unap="true">
<upd_name>Non</upd_name>
<upd_detl>ば's primordial function is to connect two clauses, clause A to clause B, where A is in some manner precedent to B, this should be in line with the citation you have just provided of a conjunction. 

Additionally, I do not see how these definitions would - or even could - be mutually exclusive: every single conjunction has a grammatical aspect to it, it must always form a syntactically subordinating or coordinating relation in between the two linked items; dismissing [3] as an omission of clause B, and with the potential exclusion of [2], ば falls into the former type.
I must also bring to attention that the definition of a conjunction provided is vague and potentially problematic, for example: how does it deal with a coordinating conjunction between two nouns? ”僕と君と...”or anything following the same structure will be constituted of two words that are not particularly large units of meaning, certainly not clauses, and I do not think most would consider each a phrase. Would と cease to be a conjunction? would also または or および? This is not limited to Japanese either, you can just as easily take "Me and you..." and the same problem arises.

Lastly, not classifying ば as a conjunction makes the corpus inconsistent: other terms formally classified as 接続助詞 such as と, けれども and its variants have both [conj] and [prt] on their entries; notably, なら and たら both directly derive from ば and are classed as [conj] (though the former's entry is itself a tad inconsistent).
Now, as the meaning does not change even in their original forms of ならば and たらば, if ば is not a conjunction, what is it? or rather, if it is not, how are they?</upd_detl>
<upd_refs>I did not think any references would be needed, It is formally classified as a 接続助詞 just about everywhere: daijs, daijr, smk, meikyo, koj...</upd_refs>
</audit>
<audit time="2024-07-07 07:55:14" stat="A">
<upd_uid>jwb</upd_uid>
<upd_name>Jim Breen</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
</audit>
<audit time="2025-07-10 06:46:44" stat="A">
<upd_uid>jwb</upd_uid>
<upd_name>Jim Breen</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_diff>@@ -21 +21 @@
-&lt;gloss&gt;why don't you...?&lt;/gloss&gt;
+&lt;gloss&gt;why don't you ...?&lt;/gloss&gt;</upd_diff>
</audit>
<audit time="2025-07-10 16:18:58" stat="A" unap="true">
<upd_name>Sombrero1</upd_name>
<upd_detl>I very much agree with what non has said previously, ば is both a particle and a conjunction. It would be inconsistent both with other entries like けど, けれど and with every major reference, to dismiss this. I think non has sufficiently explained why this should have [conj] tag (apart from sense three)</upd_detl>
<upd_refs>Every kokugo: 〔接続助詞〕
DOJG: "A conjunction which indicates that the preceding clause expresses a conditional"
JMdict's own entry for 接続助詞: "conjunction particle (e.g. "ba", "kara", "keredo", "nagara")"

.</upd_refs>
<upd_diff>@@ -9,0 +10 @@
+&lt;pos&gt;&amp;conj;&lt;/pos&gt;
@@ -14,0 +16 @@
+&lt;pos&gt;&amp;conj;&lt;/pos&gt;
@@ -24,0 +27 @@
+&lt;pos&gt;&amp;conj;&lt;/pos&gt;
@@ -29,0 +33 @@
+&lt;pos&gt;&amp;conj;&lt;/pos&gt;</upd_diff>
</audit>
<audit time="2025-07-11 01:33:29" stat="A">
<upd_uid>jwb</upd_uid>
<upd_name>Jim Breen</upd_name>
<upd_email>...address hidden...</upd_email>
<upd_detl>I yield.</upd_detl>
</audit>
</info>
</entry>



View entry in alternate formats: jel | edict | jmdict xml | jmnedict xml | jmdictdb xml